26 Replies Latest reply on May 18, 2015 10:10 PM by Billy Moon

    AutoDesk to acquire DelCam

    Lenny Bucholz

      If you haven't heard another product that runs inside of SW will be owned by the DESK!

       

      first T-Spline, then HSMWorks and Now Delcam for SW which is part of the DelCam family.

       

      http://www.reuters.com/article/2013/11/07/us-delcam-offer-autodesk-idUSBRE9A609N20131107

        • Re: AutoDesk to acquire DelCam
          John Burrill

          Autodesks motto is, "If you can't compete in the marketplace, buy it."

            • Re: AutoDesk to acquire DelCam
              Lenny Bucholz

              SW used to be the same, Cosmos, PDMWorks and a few others.....

              • Re: AutoDesk to acquire DelCam
                J. Mather

                John Burrill wrote:

                 

                Autodesks motto is, "If you can't compete in the marketplace, buy it."

                If you can't compete, but you want to compete in a related business area, what other business option would make logical sense?

                  • Re: AutoDesk to acquire DelCam
                    John Burrill

                    Well, I was being a tad cynical but not wholeheartedly so.  Mergers and aquisitions are the reality of our times. But I think the financeers are overly optimistic thinking of joining technologies, management structures, employee pools and supply chains stritcly in terms of joining market share and what I've often gotten from the end result as an employee and customer is a product with hasty and incomplete integration that produces unrealistic expectations and roadblocks for me.

                    I mean I use and appreciate the capabilities of SolidWorks Composer but this software doens't look like SolidWorks, shares none of it's interface design philosophy or referential structure and requires lots of processes and steps for working with SolidWorks models that are redundant to and sometimes inferior to SolidWorks' capabilities

                    I think the issues I encounter with this software are symptomatic of complications caused by aquiring codebases instead of creating them.

                    The real dirty work of aquiring a code base is that you have to decimate it into classes and throw a way and rewrite a lot of it.  Same thing with talent pools.  You have to not only remove redundancies from the aquired staff, y ou have to let them teach your primary staff a few things abou the way they do their jobs and maybe shift your design philosophy which means you are certainly going to alienate some of the customer base you aquired as well as your own.  You want to see a successful aquisition and integration?  CAiCE.  CAiCE was a roadway, survey infrastructure package that was used a partner product to Microstation and Bentley GeoPak.  It was CAD system agnostic and had a well-established customer base.  Autodesk bought it in 2002, ripped out it's guts-namely it's corridor and parcel tools and made them the heart of Civil 3D which they then used to successfuly compete with GeoPak in the state DOT's.shifting the advantage from Bentley to Autodesk in that sector.  I don't know if you can buy CAiCE any more.  It's last update was in 2005.

                      • Re: AutoDesk to acquire DelCam
                        J. Mather

                        There is also the issue of intellectual property law that might be a barrier to entry.  Purchasing the IP removes that barrier.

                         

                        (they also purchased Alias, Moldflow, Algor and Blue Ridge Numerics)

                          • Re: AutoDesk to acquire DelCam
                            Richard Wagenaar

                            Autodesk has interesting bundles and they have

                            integrated acquired technology fast. I don't understand

                            why they both buy HSM and Delcam, these products

                            are competitors.  Appearantly they buy customers and

                            technology.

                             

                            Autodesk did about everything that Solidworks promised

                            back in the beginning of 2010 and still hasn't done.

                             

                            http://www.deskeng.com/virtual_desktop/?p=1119

                             

                            I don't like the Cloud,  but this will problaby also happen

                            to Solidworks.

                             

                            "with 3DEXPERIENCE last July, we also did introduce this collaborative platform online, I mean cloud, for a certain number of SOLIDWORKS customers. We have a new product called Mechanical Conceptual, which is an add-on to SOLIDWORKS, but should not be perceived as an add-on, it's much more than that. Because it's a way for a SOLIDWORKS customer to use the cloud solution for collaboration, and connect with its own supply chain. So this is also an interesting evolution of how PC-based apps are becoming 3DEXPERIENCE-powered on the cloud for an expanded scope of usage."

                             

                            I understand there will be a non cloud version of Autodesk Fusion too.

                             

                            It will be interesting to see how the new direct

                            modelling in SW2015? compares to Autodesk fusion.

                             

                            I think problems in SW take too long to fix even while

                            new developments have slowed down.

                              • Re: AutoDesk to acquire DelCam
                                John Burrill

                                To tell you the truth, after the recent discoveries of how the NSA is harvesting data from online providers, I'm really thinking twice about putting content on the cloud. 

                                Between the National Security Letter which allows the FBI to seize business records enmasse without a warrant or notification and the NSA being allowed to sift through cloud servers at will with only their pleas for trust as assurance and the recent reports of contractors walking away with terabytes of data and congressmen using procurement information for insider trading, I worry that trade secrets are reserved for people that maintain their own file systems.

                                If my IT manager sells our CAD models to China at least he can technically be charged with a crime.

                              • Re: AutoDesk to acquire DelCam
                                John Burrill

                                That's a very good point, J.

                                  • Re: AutoDesk to acquire DelCam
                                    Billy Moon

                                    Well its taken them 2 years, but now it seems they have totally destroyed the quality of DelCam for SolidWorks.  Over the past year, each release has gotten progressively worse and at least for us, the product is almost totally useless.  It crashes constantly, corrects data, fails in simulation, locks up SolidWorks and a host of other bad things.  Mind you, 9 months ago it ran just fine, but since then, it only gets worse with each months release.  The literally had to withdraw one release and had a second that was DOA as far as we could tell.  RIP DelCam, you were good at one point but no more.

                                     

                                    As always, YMMV.

                                      • Re: AutoDesk to acquire DelCam
                                        Lenny Bucholz

                                        Billy,

                                         

                                        What version are you running of DelCam in what release of SW?

                                         

                                        what is not working? we have SW 2014 edu with DelCam 15 and seams to be working fine.

                                          • Re: AutoDesk to acquire DelCam
                                            Billy Moon

                                            SolidWorks 2015 x64 Edition, SP2.1

                                            Every version of DelCam V21.2.0.26 (2015 R1 SP2)  and later (roughly since last fall) have been broken

                                            Running on Windows 8.1 with all service packs

                                            8 CPU cores, 32 Gig's Ram, 2 Gig's video Ram, etc.

                                             

                                            Same computer, OS work perfectly fine -- with normal level of flaws up until late last year.  Been broken ever since.

                                             

                                            I've tested each release from V21.2.0.26 on and each one is worse than the one before.

                                             

                                            Here's an easy, highly reproducible, and highly reported defect for example:

                                                 Add a "side" mill feature

                                                 Select a couple of edges to apply the side mill to, top, bottom, etc.

                                                 On the solid model, it will show a gray arrow indicating which side you're going to mill from

                                                 Select the gray arrow to flip to the other side to mill and you get a GPF fault/crash

                                                 If you select the 'toggle' in the edit dialog it won't crash but this 'fix' won't work if you have more than one edge to mill and you have some arrows right and some wrong.  In that case, selecting the toggle flips both and your still wrong.  Selecting a gray arrow to flip just one of those side causes the crash.

                                             

                                            Here's another: Versions from last Nov till around early March if you run the simulator at the end of the simulation it simply "hangs" the simulator and you have to exit solid works to run the simulator any more.  From early March till now, the hang is gone, but now the simulation simply "exits" when it completes.  This happens for both 3D and wire mode.  In wire mode, it exits the dialog that you'd need to step through the simulation.  In 3D mode, it exits at the end of the simulation and returns to normal "CAM" view so you can't save the simulation results to do a part compare, etc.

                                             

                                            I could give you more, but you get the picture.  Each of these are HIGHLY REPRODUCIBLE and absolutely critical features.  They've been reported on just about every forum, the tech support knows about them, etc.  The product is nearly unusable with just these two defects.

                                             

                                            Other issues include calculating tool sizes wrong, having the wrong path on thread milling, ramping in finish milling wrong, measuring corner/round mills from the wrong tip, etc.  Note that NONE of these things were broken prior to last fall.  Each release has brought new 'surprises' of defects that used to no be in the product and now suddenly are there.

                                             

                                            My only conclusion, based on my personal experience, is that I'm now paying annual maintenance for someone to wreck a product that used to work.

                                              • Re: AutoDesk to acquire DelCam
                                                Lenny Bucholz

                                                Billy,

                                                 

                                                we are not having the issue.

                                                 

                                                Windows 7, SW 2014 sp 3.0 and DelCam 2015 R2

                                                 

                                                have you tried using Win 7 instead? or have you tried using a lower sp of SW, I heard they (SW) did something in SP 2.1 that gave issues to third party software.

                                                  • Re: AutoDesk to acquire DelCam
                                                    Billy Moon

                                                    As of the beginning of the year, Windows 7 is no longer a supported platform for SolidWorks.  I know that on 'older versions' of software things did work, that was sort of my point.  Things used to work, they are now broken.  They are not getting fixed.  With each new release of DelCam (not SolidWorks), the DelCam software gets worse, not better.  Why would you pay for ongoing maintenance or buy a new seat of a product like that.

                                                     

                                                    Further, I was observing that 2  years after the acquisition by a 'rival' of SolidWorks, DelCam is now broken.  I don't care if its SolidWorks breaking DelCam and then DelCam not fixing the issues or if its DelCam breaking SolidWorks versions of their software to somehow drive more business  to AutoDesk.  I just know its broken and no one is fixing it and its getting worse, not better nor staying the same. 

                                                     

                                                    My work around is to run last year's version of DelCam on the current SolidWorks.  Only a few things are broken on that combination and its not getting worse.  Each month or so when DelCam releases a new version, I download, install and test to see if anything is fixed.  When nothing has been fixed, I play around a bit to see how stable it is.  Then I re-install last year's version, b*tch a bit about it, then wait for the next month's release.  Assuming there's not a major change in direction, at the end of my contract year, I'll stop renewing my maintenance contract and start the long, painful process of selecting a new CAM solution.

                                  • Re: AutoDesk to acquire DelCam
                                    Paul Salvador

                                    RIP Delcam!