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How are grooved couplings (victaulic style) handled in routing?

Question asked by Andy Casper on Dec 12, 2018
Latest reply on Jun 14, 2019 by Andy Casper

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I am a seasoned SolidWorks designer and Admin but I am new to setting up routing, I am trying to set this up as I transition my company from AutoCAD to SolidWorks. We use a mix of flanged and grooved components. Flanges do not seem to be a problem with routing. I am trying to figure out how to deal with grooved pipe ends, groove couplings, and grooved components in routing.

Part of our push to SolidWorks is the ability to detail sections of pipe that will require a machining operation such as grooving, coping, and threading. This along with a detailed cutlist is what we are hoping to accomplish to give to our manufacturing department.

Can anyone help? Point me at a thread, point me at a video, even post an explanation below.

Thank you so much and Merry Christmas,

Andy

Kyle Taylor Mar 6, 2019 2:54 PM

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Sorry man but you're SOL. Grooves and threads are completely absent from routing. The only way of going about those is by right clicking on the pipe, set "create custom configuration" and editing the part directly to add in the threads or grooves.

I've been using routing for about 2 years now and while it has its strong points, it lacks severely in others and the stability is abysmal to the point where the wrong click will *literally* break the model.

Now I personally have moved past routing for any job requiring more than just a couple spool pieces and started using weldments with a combination of the routing library using "insert part" and custom library features. It's a little more time consuming to bring in the parts by hand and you have to know your elbow radius and stuff like that... but the drawing details I can produce are 100x better. I have a library feature part for grooves that I just drag onto the end of a pipe and it cuts the correct size groove to the pipe size configuration I select.

My only major complaint is that the weldments cut list doesn't pull and item information whatsoever so i have to name the parts. Otherwise the stability is 100%. Not a single crash since.

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Shawn Stugard Dec 12, 2018 3:58 PM
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Hello Randy,

Welcome to the forum. I'm sure someone will have some ideas about your groovy situation.
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Josh Brady Dec 12, 2018 4:22 PM
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Sorry, not familiar with routing myself, but if someone here doesn't chime in pretty quick you shouldn't hesitate to ask your VAR. If you're transitioning to SW from AutoCAD, you probably just paid them a sweet, sweet pile of fresh green money, and if they want that sweet, sweet continuing revenue stream from your annual maintenance contract, they should be more than happy to help you get set up for success with the software. If not, you should fire them and switch to a different VAR if possible. You've already paid for this support, might as well use it!
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Andy Casper Feb 20, 2019 1:16 PM
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Well, I have talked with the VAR and the answer is not simple. First, add a split point to your route, next drag in the VIC coupling. Exit the route, edit each pipe individually and add the groove feature. The groove however does not always stay as the pipe sections are sometimes recreated by routing after a change elsewhere in the assembly. (Face Palm)
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Kyle Taylor Mar 6, 2019 2:54 PM
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Sorry man but you're SOL. Grooves and threads are completely absent from routing. The only way of going about those is by right clicking on the pipe, set "create custom configuration" and editing the part directly to add in the threads or grooves.
I've been using routing for about 2 years now and while it has its strong points, it lacks severely in others and the stability is abysmal to the point where the wrong click will *literally* break the model.
Now I personally have moved past routing for any job requiring more than just a couple spool pieces and started using weldments with a combination of the routing library using "insert part" and custom library features. It's a little more time consuming to bring in the parts by hand and you have to know your elbow radius and stuff like that... but the drawing details I can produce are 100x better. I have a library feature part for grooves that I just drag onto the end of a pipe and it cuts the correct size groove to the pipe size configuration I select.
My only major complaint is that the weldments cut list doesn't pull and item information whatsoever so i have to name the parts. Otherwise the stability is 100%. Not a single crash since.
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- Peter De Vlieger @ Kyle Taylor on Mar 8, 2019 5:38 AM
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  Could 'insert coupling' be of any aid ?
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  - Kyle Taylor @ Peter De Vlieger on Mar 8, 2019 7:15 AM
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    That will insert a coupling but will not groove the pipe
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    - Peter De Vlieger @ Kyle Taylor on Mar 8, 2019 7:38 AM
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      Kyle,
      
      I didn't think it would be a solution for grooved pipe ends unless one would make a 'custom' piece with configs for the different sized pipes that one could use as a fitting. It wouldn't be pretty, model wise, but perhaps it could make something passable on a 2D drawing.
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      - Andy Casper @ Peter De Vlieger on Jun 12, 2019 2:51 PM
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        So what I have done is created a library feature that allows me to add grooves, and another to add NPT threads. I edit that particular pipe, add the feature then return to the rest of the model. Not the best work around, but it works. I feel like the advantages we were sold with routing are not worth the headache or the features it is lacking. It has been beneficial with 2 large building layouts we have done, but for day to day pump station plumbing it often seems more cumbersome until I get to the BOM.
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Peter De Vlieger Jun 13, 2019 2:32 AM
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I didn't know this until recently when Marco Janssen pointed it out to me but...

look at the threaded pipe as is available to you in the library that Solidworks provides.
C:\ProgramData\Solidworks\Solidworks 2018\design library\routing\piping\threaded fittings (npt)\threaded steel pipe

If one can do it for threaded then I would expect that one should be able to also specify the groove.
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- Marco Janssen @ Peter De Vlieger on Jun 13, 2019 3:37 AM
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  Oh I do use grooved ends with routing, I indeed have modified the Piping as Peter De Vlieger says, It works for me.
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  - Andy Casper @ Marco Janssen on Jun 13, 2019 10:06 AM
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    Macro Janssen,
    
    Are those pre-configured pipe lengths, or is it adding the groove to custom pieces?
    
    I guess my next question would be how do you go from welded pieces to grooved? Example would be a spool that has a slip-on flange on one end and grooved end on the other. We do this kind of thing a lot because of butterfly valves or manifolds with weld on caps and some connections are grooved and others fanged. I included some examples of how we use our connections and a simple station.
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    - Peter De Vlieger @ Andy Casper on Jun 13, 2019 10:25 AM
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      Andy,
      
      If you look at the threaded pipe I mentioned you'll understand how it's build and how it can be used.
      In other words, the pipe is set up so that it automatically puts thread (or groove) at the right location measured from the ends of the pipe no matter how long the pipe is. As long as each bit of pipe between fittings is long enough to have enough room for the grooves.
      
      Logically you should be able to make a pipe with only one end grooved. However then it will depend on where you start the pipe to get the groove on the end you want.
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      - Andy Casper @ Peter De Vlieger on Jun 13, 2019 10:36 AM
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        Thank you Peter, I will dig into that more later this afternoon. I am new to routing, and my VAR was not much help when I asked them this question.
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        Kyle Taylor @ Andy Casper on Jun 13, 2019 1:52 PM
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        Solidworks currently doesn't have the functionality to just set a grooved/threaded/welded end of pipe sections. Though after all these years you'd think that would be a feature but routing is somewhere near the bottom of the list of things that gets improvements. It makes sense on paper to have different pipe types, but in reality we mix threaded, grooved, and welded parts in a single route very regularly. I moved away from routing on complex routes and have created a library of parts and features to do it all in weldments. Some things are little more labor intensive like inserting flanges, but the stability and ability to manipulate the 3D sketch is 100x better than routing
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        Peter De Vlieger @ Kyle Taylor on Jun 14, 2019 2:58 AM
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        Kyle,
        
        Routing has it's problems and indeed is low on the list of priorities, the piping section in it even more so it seems but....
        
        It still let one work quicker and more efficient, once things have been set up to your liking and to what the module can handle. This however can take a while, a long while. It took us years to have a library of fittings and a methodology that actually works. Yes, one should get the routing course, to have some of the basics and then..... ignore most of what they taught you and learn by yourself or from other how to actually make it do what is needed and what is logical.
        
        Concerning what one can do with it,e.g.: just a snippet of the Biogas plant a couple of my collegues have been and are designing from the ground up.
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        Marco Janssen @ Kyle Taylor on Jun 14, 2019 3:59 AM
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        Kyle Taylor I have to agree with Peter De Vlieger once setup (and yes that takes a long time, trial, error and headaches ) routing does save a lot of time.
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        Kyle Taylor @ Marco Janssen on Jun 14, 2019 8:31 AM
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        I dont disagree with you. I have my library pretty well set up for what we need. When it works it is very fast... but I've had too many jobs that should have been just a few hours turn into a nightmare. Solidworks just decided to change elbows on you or refuse to change the sketch.. or even FLIP parts of a sketch in the wrong direction. Unfortunately the nature of our work requires mannny revisions to the model sometimes, and often a change of pipe size and fitting types. SW does not handle that well and we have had to start all over because it just can't be fixed. Dont get me wrong, I do like the tool. They just have a long, long way to go before routing is as great of a tool as it claims to be.
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        Andy Casper @ Kyle Taylor on Jun 14, 2019 8:47 AM
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        Unfortunately, we are in the beloved AutoCAD to SolidWorks transition, so I do not get as much time to work with Routing as I would like to. Most of my focus is in creation and setting up part libraries and developing standards and naming conventions that have been all but non-existent {when i'm not buried in production work}. I had only seen demos of SolidWorks Routing when it came time to make the decision about purchasing licenses. I see the potential power of it, and I much prefer how the BOM is similar to a cutlist for a weldment. However there seems like there is much missing, and it is not as intuitive as the rest of the SolidWorks package. Maybe it is the learning curve and not being completely immersed in Routing everyday...but listening to all of your experiences, it sounds like it is great in some aspects, but lacking in others. Hopefully like all aspects of SolidWorks it grows and becomes better as they move forward.
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    - Marco Janssen @ Andy Casper on Jun 14, 2019 3:54 AM
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      Andy Casper Those are not pre-configured pipe lengths. The lengths are as per the length of the routing sketch so any length is possible.
      I always have a groove at both ends. So I made the sketch drawing in a way that both grooves are in one sketch. I suppose if you setup the pipe with each groove in a separate sketch you can suppres the groove you don't need (at the flange side). You will have to do this manually, I cannot think of any way to do this automatically.
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How are grooved couplings (victaulic style) handled in routing?

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