27 Replies Latest reply on Jun 30, 2018 2:45 PM by Martin Wsk

    not allowed to updated to a service pack released after active subscription ended.

    Rohit Rajan

      Capture.JPGNot allowing to update service pack released after active subscription ended is a poor decision by solidworks.

      it is just bullying and nothing else.

      I wish common sense prevails and they change this decision and allow customers who have no active subscription to allow to update to a service pack of the version of Solidworks they have already paid for.

      Service pack mostly contains correction of bugs which were present in early releases.

        • Re: not allowed to updated to a service pack released after active subscription ended.
          John Stoltzfus

          Rohit Rajan -

           

          So you drive your car past the last Gas Station and you didn't fuel up, don't think the Gas Company will just give you "Free Gas Milage", you just ran out of Gas, did you not?

           

          This isn't about being bullied, it's all about you paying till you get to a certain point and when you refuse to pay, then the service stops, don't know anyone that would extend that, except maybe a Mother...

            • Re: not allowed to updated to a service pack released after active subscription ended.
              Rohit Rajan

              then go out there and find out that such kind of services do exist.

              As far as i know PTC Creo formerly Pro/Engineer does allow to install service pack for the version i have paid for.(After the Subscription has ended)

              I do have a Pro/Engineer License.

              • Re: not allowed to updated to a service pack released after active subscription ended.
                Rob Edwards

                John Stoltzfus wrote:

                 

                Rohit Rajan -

                 

                So you drive your car past the last Gas Station and you didn't fuel up, don't think the Gas Company will just give you "Free Gas Milage", you just ran out of Gas, did you not?

                 

                This isn't about being bullied, it's all about you paying till you get to a certain point and when you refuse to pay, then the service stops, don't know anyone that would extend that, except maybe a Mother...

                 

                I disagree here John

                These are 'bug fixes' not new features.  Most other software I have gets free patches

                  • Re: not allowed to updated to a service pack released after active subscription ended.
                    John Stoltzfus

                    Rob Edwards - most respected - but this is SolidWorks, not the "most other software"

                      • Re: not allowed to updated to a service pack released after active subscription ended.
                        Rob Edwards

                        But it's a lottery!  Depending when in the year you purchase your seat.  I would be happier being stuck on SW20XX SP5 than SW20XX+1 SP1

                         

                        My experience with 2015 was terrible bugs.  and 2016 sp1 was unusable

                        Just upgraded to 2016

                         

                        Im happy now by the way I've got 2018

                          • Re: not allowed to updated to a service pack released after active subscription ended.
                            Dennis Dohogne

                            Rob Edwards wrote:

                             

                            But it's a lottery! Depending when in the year you purchase your seat. I would be happier being stuck on SW20XX SP5 than SW20XX+1 SP1

                             

                            My experience with 2015 was terrible bugs. and 2016 sp1 was unusable

                            Just upgraded to 2016

                             

                            Im happy now by the way I've got 2018

                            I agree with this, but sometimes the problem is a person upgrades to the next version, or needs to due to a customer requirement, and THEN you find out there are problems.  It is a big deal because there is no going back (no backwards compatibility).  (I'm not trying to start a chant asking for backwards compatibility because I have learned enough to appreciate that really is not possible with this type of software.)

                             

                            A little over a year ago I had upgraded to SWX2017 and had such problems all the way into SP2.0 that I had to revert to using 2016 SP5.0, which was very stable.  I had to recreate all the work I had done in SWX2017 and I WAS PI$$ED!  About that time ONE and TWO was getting some traction and I was fanning that flame.  There were other very unhappy and yet constructive posts going on around that time as well.  One of them mentioned they felt SWX was becoming Ransomeware, where they (SWX) would get you committed to the most recent release and then when you had problems the only way out was to upgrade to the next release, much less the next Service Pack.  At the time I certainly felt the same way.

                             

                            Here's an example situation.  Let's say my subscription runs out so that the last SP I was entitled to was SWX2017 SP2.0.  Then I run into MAJOR problems.  The VAR is no longer obligated to help me, but let's say he does and determines there happens to be a fix for my problem in SP3.0 which just came out.  At one time there was a policy that if you had a documented problem that was fixed in an SP after your subscription expired that you were entitled to that SP, but I have no idea if this is still in place.  I rather doubt this policy is still in place because I know for a fact that even if you have an SP later than one you are entitled to that you cannot install it since the software checks your license number and will not go any further.  So, for this example, I have software that has me painted into a corner.  I cannot use it due my work, yet I cannot get a fix since I'm off subscription.  The extorsion angle comes into play here, where I can get a solution if I just pay-up and reactivate my subscription.

                             

                            My suggestion for a solution is that when you buy the software you are entitled to SP5.0 (or whatever the latest/last iteration of that version happens to be called) of the latest version you are entitled to, regardless of when your one-year subscription runs out.  So, for my example above, if I had purchased SWX2016 in March of 2016 my first download would be SWX2016 SP2.0.  In March of 2017 I would be on SWX2017 SP2.0 and my subscription and therefore my VAR support ends, but I would still be allowed to download and install all SP's for SWX2017 up to and including SP5.0.  In that situation I would be able to get the SP's to fix my bugs without having to revert to using SWX2016.

                             

                            I have sent this to some of the top folks at SWX, but they never addressed it.

                              • Re: not allowed to updated to a service pack released after active subscription ended.
                                M. D.

                                The fact they don't do this shows me that they are hemorrhaging customers and are afraid they have nothing left to offer the industry and have to resort to dubious tactics to keep making money.

                                • Re: not allowed to updated to a service pack released after active subscription ended.
                                  Rob Edwards

                                  Dennis

                                  I shared your frustration.  Maybe slightly rashly I'm going to relay the experience that almost drove me over the edge and under the bus.

                                  But I'll start by backing off a little bit.  As most of you probably know I'm a regular here on this forum, I love it and I log on here before I check my e-mails in the morning!  I also love Solidworks - it is an amazing tool that is capable of so much.

                                  I helped found the company I work for..  we started off with basically an empty barn and a few old machines and just the two of us.

                                  We always knew we were capable of good work, but I never could have anticipated just how much hard work it is to build a company from scratch.  Pretty much all the profit (? - lol) from every job must be ploughed back into investing in new tools and materials.  Little by little, year by year we grew.  After a decade of hardwork and sacrifice we were recognised for our excellence by winning a national award.  This opened the doors to some exciting opportunities and I was very happy when we introduced Solidworks to the company.

                                  I remember clearly the sales rep visiting us.  We gave him a tour of the workshop and showed him the work we did.

                                  He promised us that Solidworks would be perfectly suited to our work and that the VAR support would assist us in setting things up.

                                  I have spent a lot of time learning the software myself (60 hour plus weeks are normal if you're self employed!)  Anyway it went OK at first when I was just doing one off simple models, but then we got a break, the biggest job our company had ever had.  We're talking 40 doors in a castle, a budget of about £250,000.

                                  Now we were very aware of the risk involved in a such a big job comparatively.  I had about a month to prepare and I carefully made some models, we even made a full size sample and installed it.

                                  When diagnosing any problem, there are always many factors that contribute... we must accept that life is imperfect and roll with it.  We were slightly delayed by the building contractor in getting access to the site to template the doors, and I spent two weeks on site templating the openings.  On our return we had high resolution photography of the templates done and imported into Solidworks.  It was brilliant, we had a pixel resolution of 0.25mm.

                                  I had to sort out the various openings we had to contend with and create a minimum number of standard frames that would fit.

                                  Lets says an hour for each door, well that's a weeks work.

                                  I was using an inserted part of the arch shape to drive my model and it worked fine in testing.  When I created my configurations via design table the configuration of the inserted part was inconsistent.  I couldn't understand what was going wrong.  We still had a couple of weeks left on our subscription so I contacted our VAR.  You all know how this works.  You've got a problem and probably a deadline looming.  So you spend a few precious hours communicating the problem and then wait...

                                  In the meantime you just have to proceed.  Well this was not the only problem I had, for some reason my files sizes were growing enormously with every save, until they were unworkable.  It was ridiculous, about every 3 saves I would have to pack and go to create a new assembly that was in the MegaBytes.  The file sizes were growing into the Gigabytes.

                                  Anyway I persevered, working through many nights and all was good I had an assembly made that looked perfect  I had it all done just in time before work in the shop would come to a stop.  I printed out my cutlist, it was hopelessly corrupted... I was crushed!

                                  Now I understand that I probably made some mistakes, but there are some serious bugs in 2015!  Pretty much every time I contacted my VAR the outcome was an SPR.   (You get a e-mail about a week later).  There were many serious bugs in 2015.

                                   

                                  Now It took us three years on finance to pay for our one year subscription, yet the money/time we have lost through problems easily outweighs the cost of the software in it's entirety.  So what can I do?  Upgrading to a low level service pack in 2016, that was just as bad.

                                  I had basically had enough with Solidworks, I got the people from Solid Edge around.  At the time they were offering a free license with a 3 year subscription.  It was touch and go but in the end I decided to stick with Solidworks and I'm happy to report we have now bought a second seat.  Running 2016 sp5 has been very stable and I am happy, but Solidworks was so close to being booted from our company.

                                  If anyone from Solidworks reads this I would like them to take this from it.

                                  We your customers invest our time, and our very livelihoods in your product.  We have a shared vested interest, a partnership if you like.

                                  I studied computer science at university and I fully understand the complexities of software development.  However I do also fully understand testing before release.  Many of the bugs I have encountered prove to me that you do not test comprehensively enough before release.  Or if you do you don't care.  Having such a cavalier attitude sucks.  We are not interested in new bells and whistles, we just want something dependable.  The bugs cost us more than the software itself (I think I lost a few months of my life with this experience)

                                   

                                  In our experience no other significant outlay for our company (computers/software/machinery) has caused us so many problems.  Without this forum and the amazing wisdom that is freely shared by the community we would not have renewed.

                                   

                                  By the way our company offers a lifetime guarantee for our products.  If there is ever a problem as long as we're still going...we will fix it!

                            • Re: not allowed to updated to a service pack released after active subscription ended.
                              Kameron Smith

                              Rob Edwards wrote:

                              These are 'bug fixes' not new features.

                               

                              I have to disagree with this...  While bug fixes are one main component of Service Packs, they are also used to release new minor features and enhancements to existing features.  Check out the release notes for any Service Pack and you will see them listed.

                               

                              I'm not weighing in on DS's policy.  I just thought this distinction needed to be made.

                               

                              ~Kam

                          • Re: not allowed to updated to a service pack released after active subscription ended.
                            David Matula

                            It all comes down to knowing, when you buy.  Most of us have learned that the last service pack comes out late October.  So if you negotiate your contract to start about then you could possibly end your service agreement with the latest service pack.  But if for some reason it is delayed, you can forget about it.  Same thing about sending in enhancement request or most other things.  I would think that buying the software is kind of like buying a car, you negotiate anything and everything.  Not that they will be able to give you everything that you want.

                            • Re: not allowed to updated to a service pack released after active subscription ended.
                              Tom Gagnon

                              Or, stick with the final SP of previous year's release when you anticipate ending support contract, instead of upgrading to latest year without intent of maintaining subscription until last SP is released.

                               

                              Time is passing.

                              • Re: not allowed to updated to a service pack released after active subscription ended.
                                John Burrill

                                This shouldn't have taken you by surprise.  SolidWorks has always had the policy that updates are available only to people on active subscription since...always.

                                Their business is built around subscription, which includes product support and annual updates

                                • Re: not allowed to updated to a service pack released after active subscription ended.
                                  Ionel Popa

                                  I don't understand what problem is... As long as you paying for service you getting all features, updates and bug fixes. It's like paying for cleaning your home -  if you fired your your housemaid and found some dirt after it , you can't call her and say "clean it up for free, it's old dirt". Am i wrong?

                                  • Re: not allowed to updated to a service pack released after active subscription ended.
                                    Martin Wsk

                                    Maybe you can try to download the whole dvd on goengineer (just google). There are all service packs for download. Of course you still need your serial key but it could work.