31 Replies Latest reply on Jul 9, 2018 7:56 AM by Alin Vargatu

    Custom Round Stock Tool

    James Pare

      I am looking for a tool that will draw a round stock block around custom pins

      It always needs to grow to cover the model changes, features added or removed

      I would prefer it would also work to set stock sizes that we could add - nearest fractional inch....

      Bounding box from SWX is always square & will not work in all casesPIn Stock.jpg

       

      Anyone have anything like this out there?

        • Re: Custom Round Stock Tool
          Alin Vargatu

          Before SW2018 came with the Bounding Box for parts feature, one of my customers needed this functionality for tubes. I asked Artem Taturevych and Viktor Bovzdarenko to add a macro in the #TASK library and they wrote this one:

           

           

          It might be worth asking them to do the same thing for the new Bounding Box functionality.

            • Re: Custom Round Stock Tool
              James Pare

              Thanks Deepak

              I have a feeling this might be better, but still not work for the reason that the top of the pin is square

              This will result in a square bounding box of the same size, but to have the proper round stock size it must be bigger than than the square, the round feature must fully encompass the square

              • Re: Custom Round Stock Tool
                James Pare

                Yeah, this is a cool Macro, but not what I need

                basically I want to take any model & find the round stock needed to cut the detail from

                Would encompass the overall shape & length even when features are added

                Shapes would be fully customized from slots, squares, diamonds....

                Basically looking to create a round stock tool for the BOM

                  • Re: Custom Round Stock Tool
                    Alin Vargatu

                    James Pare wrote:

                     

                    Yeah, this is a cool Macro, but not what I need

                    basically I want to take any model & find the round stock needed to cut the detail from

                    Would encompass the overall shape & length even when features are added

                    Shapes would be fully customized from slots, squares, diamonds....

                    Basically looking to create a round stock tool for the BOM

                    Is the costing functionality for round bar stock material not good enough?

                • Re: Custom Round Stock Tool
                  Alin Vargatu

                  I am just thinking that once you have the stock sizes from the Bounding Box tool as custom properties, it is a simple equation to calculate the diameter to the next standard size. Pythagoras should know.

                   

                  Excel would do, or a global variable with a nice equation...

                   

                  The only thing SW will have trouble figuring out on its own is the orientation of the part.

                  • Re: Custom Round Stock Tool
                    Alin Vargatu

                    James, let me know if this algorithm would work for you. Deepak Gupta, Artem Taturevych, Viktor Bovzdarenko, please chime in.

                     

                    The programming seems doable to me, with little effort, as long as the length of the pin is the biggest dimension. This is strategy I suggest. James, Deepak, Artem, Viktor please correct me if I am wrong:

                     

                    1. Create bounding box for the part using SW functionality. Configuration specific properties are automatically created.

                     

                    1. For a round part, there are 2 properties with equal values. They determine the finished size diameter = Width value (when the part is round)
                    2. The third custom property (which is not equal with the other two) is the finished length.
                    3. Use an equation to round the finished diameter to next standard fractional size to determine the stock size diameter
                    4. Write the result in a custom property as Stock Diameter x Finished Length

                     

                    James, would such a macro work for you?

                     

                    Ravi Shrivastava, this functionality should be added to SOLDIWORKS ASAP. Most of my customers would benefit from it!

                    BTW, Ravi, we are aware of the Costing functionality, but is cumbersome and does not update without user interactions. Thanks for your attention!

                      • Re: Custom Round Stock Tool
                        James Pare

                        Sorry Alin but your are simplifying the pins way to much

                        We deal with custom pins on every jobs & cannot have limitations

                        Pins can be full form, round, square, hex.....

                        The is no guarantee that the length is the biggest dimension

                         

                        I am going to add a couple pictures

                        I need a feature that will stay at the bottom of the tree

                        Always drawing a round sketch to encompass the entire part

                        The length then covers the entire length, even if a new feature is added (same with size)

                        Round stock.pngRound stock-2.png

                          • Re: Custom Round Stock Tool
                            Alin Vargatu

                            James Pare wrote:

                             

                            Sorry Alin but your are simplifying the pins way to much

                            We deal with custom pins on every jobs & cannot have limitations

                            Pins can be full form, round, square, hex.....

                            The is no guarantee that the length is the biggest dimension

                             

                            I am going to add a couple pictures

                            I need a feature that will stay at the bottom of the tree

                            Always drawing a round sketch to encompass the entire part

                            The length then covers the entire length, even if a new feature is added (same with size)

                            Round stock.pngRound stock-2.png

                            In this case see you over in the 2019 BETA forum. I think you might have your answer there.

                            • Re: Custom Round Stock Tool
                              Alin Vargatu

                              James Pare wrote:

                               

                              Sorry Alin but your are simplifying the pins way to much

                              We deal with custom pins on every jobs & cannot have limitations

                              Pins can be full form, round, square, hex.....

                              The is no guarantee that the length is the biggest dimension

                               

                               

                              If the length is not the biggest dimension, than how would the software figure out the orientation of the bounding cylinder?

                                • Re: Custom Round Stock Tool
                                  James Pare

                                  I would have the tool allow the user select a face to start the round sketch on

                                    • Re: Custom Round Stock Tool
                                      Alin Vargatu

                                      James Pare wrote:

                                       

                                      I would have the tool allow the user select a face to start the round sketch on

                                      That would simplify the workflow tremendously. The software will use the projection of the bounding box on the selected face/plane as input for the circle, then an ExtrudeBoss with All option would do the trick.

                                       

                                      Agree?

                                       

                                      Still,  check 2019.

                                        • Re: Custom Round Stock Tool
                                          James Pare

                                          I would even suggest being able to select a round feature to locate the round extrude

                                          Sometimes pins are offset & you would want the stock concentric to a set feature

                                          User interaction is OK

                                            • Re: Custom Round Stock Tool
                                              Alin Vargatu

                                              James Pare wrote:

                                               

                                              I would even suggest being able to select a round feature to locate the round extrude

                                              Sometimes pins are offset & you would want the stock concentric to a set feature

                                              User interaction is OK

                                              I would suggest to start with getting a simple routine that could automate 90% of the cases (or whatever percentage you have for symmetrical parts). Reduce the user input to minimum for such a routine.

                                               

                                              Once you have it, depending how many odd cases you encounter, you can look into adding complexity to the macro, or creating a new one.

                                      • Re: Custom Round Stock Tool
                                        Rob Edwards

                                        Hi James

                                        Here's a technique I've been using to create my own bounding box of planes on the fly...  it works easy for boxes but it's trickier with round stock.  It's the classic minimum circle problem! Smallest-circle problem - Wikipedia

                                        You need to have some knowledge of the part orientation.

                                        I use the Through All setting on a Boss Extrude, then create a plane of the end face.

                                         

                                        You have to do it patiently, first one way, then the other for each axis.

                                         

                                        Once you get the box, a couple of midplanes to get the axis, then two sketched circles and two extrudes

                                         

                                        This works fine for simple cases but as can be observed the problem lies with something like this

                                        Whatever technique you use I guess you'll always have this problem when rounding a box.

                                         

                                        An idea I had was to spin the pin..

                                        adding a circular pattern, presents the pin at various relative positions

                                        seemed to help but it's not quite right

                                        I used a circle centred in the bounding box, but this axis may not be the pin axis.

                                        ..adding 2 more extrudes would fix this if the pin axis is available

                                        good luck!

                                        2018 attached

                                      • Re: Custom Round Stock Tool
                                        Deepak Gupta

                                        This can surely work but like James mentioned, user interaction would be needed. So I would suggest for an add-in to take care of the extruded bounding box.

                                          • Re: Custom Round Stock Tool
                                            James Pare

                                            An Add in or a macro that would run?

                                             

                                            If I am waiting for a SWX add-in i'll be looking at 2020 at the earliest

                                              • Re: Custom Round Stock Tool
                                                Alin Vargatu

                                                James Pare wrote:

                                                 

                                                An Add in or a macro that would run?

                                                 

                                                If I am waiting for a SWX add-in i'll be looking at 2020 at the earliest

                                                Let’s nail the definition of your request and make a SWPUC out of it. Would you agree to that?

                                                 

                                                I will provide the points for the awards.

                                                  • Re: Custom Round Stock Tool
                                                    James Pare

                                                    What's the timeline on a SWPUC project?

                                                      • Re: Custom Round Stock Tool
                                                        Alin Vargatu

                                                        James Pare wrote:

                                                         

                                                        What's the timeline on a SWPUC project?

                                                        If we launched it today, we can set the deadline for all solutions for next Friday.

                                                         

                                                        That being said, a good solution could be submitted much sooner than that.

                                                         

                                                        So... let's define the request in simple words.

                                                          • Re: Custom Round Stock Tool
                                                            James Pare

                                                            Ok

                                                            A semi-automated solution that will determined the round stock required for machining of a detail from a lathe

                                                            We agree that the user will select either a face or plane to define the direction of the round extrude

                                                            The feature will by dynamic where it will fully update to suit geometry changes

                                                            The diameter must encompass the entire model at all times

                                                              • Re: Custom Round Stock Tool
                                                                Alin Vargatu

                                                                James Pare wrote:

                                                                 

                                                                Ok

                                                                A semi-automated solution that will determined the round stock required for machining of a detail from a lathe

                                                                We agree that the user will select either a face or plane to define the direction of the round extrude

                                                                The feature will by dynamic where it will fully update to suit geometry changes

                                                                The diameter must encompass the entire model at all times

                                                                Perfect. Can you please provide several parts for testing? Please manually add this feature at the end. This way, the programmers can see exactly what they need.

                                                                Also, should the macro add material up to the next 1/16" to the finished diameter automatically?

                                                                 

                                                                You can email me the files directly.

                                                                 

                                                                I will launch the challenge the moment I have your files.

                                                                  • Re: Custom Round Stock Tool
                                                                    James Pare

                                                                    Alin

                                                                    I would prefer an option to either turn on or off the rounding up

                                                                    If I had to make a decision I would say we start with rounding on

                                                                      • Re: Custom Round Stock Tool
                                                                        Alin Vargatu

                                                                        James Pare wrote:

                                                                         

                                                                        Alin

                                                                        I would prefer an option to either turn on or off the rounding up

                                                                        If I had to make a decision I would say we start with rounding on

                                                                        Is 1/16" the step? Or would you prefer 1/8".

                                                                        Of course, the macro can ask the user to input the number, but adding more user interaction would defeat the purpose.

                                                                         

                                                                        Maybe the macro would have a property manager where some settings are pre-populated, as per the latest user input:

                                                                         

                                                                        1. Select face (the default could be the face farthest away in the positive direction of the "Y" axis).

                                                                        2. Select Direction (the default is normal to the selected face, in the negative "Y" axis direction). I imagine this can be as a check box to flip direction.

                                                                        3. Input next stock size step (the default is 0 (zero), or the latest value input by the user).

                                                                         

                                                                        Item 3 can also be as a series of radio buttons: 0 or 1/16 or 1/8. If you want other steps, let me know.

                                                      • Re: Custom Round Stock Tool
                                                        Artem Taturevych

                                                        Hi James, Alin,

                                                         

                                                        I have a macro which can found the best fit bounding cylinder. Macro can be accessed here: Get Body Bounding Cylinder

                                                         

                                                        This is just a proof-of-concept macro, but if there is an interest I can make an add-in from it so it can be auto-updatable (i..e macro feature) as well as lookup the size in the table, etc.).


                                                        Thanks,
                                                        Artem

                                                        • Re: Custom Round Stock Tool
                                                          Alin Vargatu

                                                          Submit your ERs for this new functionality here: Bounding Cylinder (Round Stock) Add-In. These are not SW ERs, but Artem ERs.   At least for now