36 Replies Latest reply on Jun 14, 2018 12:00 PM by Matt Peneguy

    Hole decimal size

    S. Leacox

      I found one thread similar to this. but it really did not answer my question.

       

      Here is the situation.

      We use a punch with specific decimal hose sizes like 0.39" and 0.261"

      I have to make sure the flat patterns of sheet metal that use those holes have exactly that size. Not any other close common fractional size. In this way exported flat patterns going through nesting software match the punch tooling.

       

      Also I want to use those holes on a pattern for patterning bolts down stream in assembly. So I want to use an actual hole, not a cut.

       

      What is the right kind of hole selection for this? The hole wants to show up as 25/64 not 0.261

        • Re: Hole decimal size
          John Stoltzfus

          Change your options to show decimal instead of fractions

          • Re: Hole decimal size
            Dan Pihlaja

            Alternatively, you can use the legacy hole (not sure why it is called legacy when it should be called custom):

             

            You can even change what type of hole it is.

              • Re: Hole decimal size
                Erik Bilello

                Back in the day, what is now called Legacy was the way all the Hole Wizard options were configured.  Plug in the numbers you want for each dimension on the hole type you selected.  After the ability to select holes by fastener size was added, the original was retained as "Legacy".  I agree that "Custom" would make more sense.

                  • Re: Hole decimal size
                    Dan Pihlaja

                    Thank you for the explanation! 

                    • Re: Hole decimal size
                      Matt Peneguy

                      Erik Bilello wrote:

                       

                      Back in the day, what is now called Legacy was the way all the Hole Wizard options were configured. Plug in the numbers you want for each dimension on the hole type you selected. After the ability to select holes by fastener size was added, the original was retained as "Legacy". I agree that "Custom" would make more sense.

                      Words mean things.  "Legacy" to me (without going to merriam webster) means "old and to be deprecated as soon as possible".  I agree, "Custom" is a much more reassuring word to use for this application...Unless SW plans to get rid of that functionality.  And I don't think they do.

                  • Re: Hole decimal size
                    S. Leacox

                    I found out I was sweating nothing. I can't find any advantage of using a wizard hole over a cut. Cuts pattern just fine. And parts pattern just fine from the pattern cuts.

                     

                    Is there something I'm missing here?

                     

                    Using SW2017

                      • Re: Hole decimal size
                        Christopher Culver

                        For your situation, it being sheet metal and just a simple hole, I don't see an advantage either way.

                          • Re: Hole decimal size
                            S. Leacox

                            In what situation is it an advantage to use a wizard hole over a cut other than adding thread or configuring the hole it's self.

                            So I guess the question does not have to do with getting the geometry in place for the hole. Just anything down stream in assembly.

                              • Re: Hole decimal size
                                Christopher Culver

                                For your case,  if you have a bunch of holes of the same size, and need to make a print, the cut-extrude will not contain that information even if it is created with a pattern, you would have to manually enter the number of instances. Also for an assembly feature with multiple holes of the same size using the same hardware in the assembly, I believe that it has an advantage to use hole wizard as you can then use the hole wizard feature to create an assembly pattern to insert the same hardware part into all instances, whereas you cannot use an extruded cut in the same way, and as easily without another step.

                                 

                                I would take Dan's suggestion also, after you use the hole wizard, if you choose to and modify the dimension, re-name the feature in your feature tree so you know what it is, rather than the SWX default name given to it, which would no longer be accurate.

                                  • Re: Hole decimal size
                                    S. Leacox

                                    Attached is an example of the End assembly. Very simple case to keep the file small.

                                      • Re: Hole decimal size
                                        Christopher Culver

                                        By looking at that, I'd say there really isn't an advantage to either way, unless you make a drawing of the part and need the number of instances to be automatically applied. Or in the case that the base sketch you used(sketch 5), was also used for the locations of a different size hole needing a different size fastener, then you would have to manually choose/skip which sketch points needed which component pattern(but being that you used that same sketch to pattern the hole, I don't think this is the case, just something to consider).

                                         

                                        I know some people are rather picky about how many features exist in the feature tree, and using as little as possible. Using the hole wizard would remove the need to have the sketch driven pattern of the cut in the feature tree as shown in the attached.(I also renamed the feature I used in the feature tree to describe my interpretation of what you are using)

                                          • Re: Hole decimal size
                                            S. Leacox

                                            Thank you Christopher.

                                             

                                            So the drafting of the flat pattern could be a step simpler if I used the Legacy Hole wizard vs. just cutting the holes.

                                             

                                            I think the other thing worth considering is the file is lighter weight with cuts vs the hole wizard.

                                             

                                            When I get to more complex parts, I have some with 50 weld nuts of different sizes. Each requiring a different size hole.

                                             

                                            Taking things a step further. The size hole needed for each weldnut is a sketch inside the weldnut. I wonder if I could use that to dive the hole size. Then by simply selecting the configuration of weld nut, the hole would automatically change size. This is a common change I have to make to models right now. It all depends on what is being mounted. Both hole patterns are holes sized are commonly added and removed over time to the same piece of sheet metal.

                                             

                                            The models I work with are not that large. So minimizing the tree is not much of an issue. My goal is to learn methods that minimize the time it takes to create and edit the files. My problem is the volume of custom parts we make. I use a Boxx computer that is very capable for the small models I use. Typically I create two to five new products a day, each consisting of 12 pieces of sheet metal. Simple stuff in high volume.

                                             

                                            My instructions are always like this: Take model X, add 3" here (Typically a tank) and make it aluminum instead of Carbon steel. And change the mounted reels from Brand Y to Brand Z.

                                      • Re: Hole decimal size
                                        Jeremy Feist

                                        if you happen to use toolbox fasteners - they can read the holewizard hole information and autosize when inserted into the assembly

                                  • Re: Hole decimal size
                                    Todd Blacksher

                                    S. Leacox wrote:

                                     

                                    Here is the situation.

                                    We use a punch with specific decimal hose sizes like 0.39" and 0.261"

                                    I have to make sure the flat patterns of sheet metal that use those holes have exactly that size. Not any other close common fractional size. In this way exported flat patterns going through nesting software match the punch tooling.

                                     

                                    Also I want to use those holes on a pattern for patterning bolts down stream in assembly. So I want to use an actual hole, not a cut.

                                     

                                    What is the right kind of hole selection for this? The hole wants to show up as 25/64 not 0.261

                                    Just to throw something else into the mix -

                                     

                                    A very, very long time ago I was a really big fan of setting up Hole Wizard Favorites.

                                    (Basically custom hole sizes that could be easily selected)

                                    We had a very specific reason for using these, we had holes with unique diameters and depths that we used for almost everything.

                                    (Thru Sleeves and Inserts going into composite panels.)

                                     

                                    For me the biggest "perk" of using the Hole Wizard is that you are basically "throwing points" into a sketch to locate your holes - If I put drawer glides or hinges into my model, I could "Edit Part" for the panel, start the Hole Wizard, and pick up the centers of all the "attachment points."

                                    It also made patterning hardware a snap, and getting all of the hole details (with accurate quantities) on the print was pretty nice too.

                                     

                                    Depending on the amount of punch tooling you have, I would take a serious look at creating favorites - Then you can just grab it from the drop down menu at the top.

                                     

                                    I'm in a different industry now, so I don't use it like this any more, but it sure saved me a lot of time back then!

                                    todd

                                      • Re: Hole decimal size
                                        S. Leacox

                                        Great suggestion. I currently have a list of about 20 different hole sizes that are specific to each item inserted into sheet metal get threads welded into place. Bungs, Couplings, weld-nuts, etc.

                                         

                                        That would be a good method of keeping track of the desired hole sizes. I was hoping to find a method where the hole would automatically be added if the item was added. I have yet to find a method that allows a part to start with an assembly cut of anti-matter ---not a joke even though the idea is funny.

                                          • Re: Hole decimal size
                                            David Matula

                                            Adding a hole when inserting a part....  I think that has been done. 

                                            • Re: Hole decimal size
                                              Jeremy Feist

                                              see my earlier reply - smart components can add holes when they are added to an assembly.Capture.PNG

                                              • Re: Hole decimal size
                                                Todd Blacksher

                                                S. Leacox wrote:

                                                 

                                                Great suggestion. I currently have a list of about 20 different hole sizes that are specific to each item inserted into sheet metal get threads welded into place. Bungs, Couplings, weld-nuts, etc.

                                                 

                                                That would be a good method of keeping track of the desired hole sizes. I was hoping to find a method where the hole would automatically be added if the item was added. I have yet to find a method that allows a part to start with an assembly cut of anti-matter ---not a joke even though the idea is funny.

                                                I forgot to add another really cool detail - because you would be doing it through the Hole Wizard, you could easily "swap" to a different size if you needed to change the weld-nut!

                                                t

                                                still laughing about "modeling with anti-matter" . . . thanks, I needed that!

                                                  • Re: Hole decimal size
                                                    S. Leacox

                                                    If there was a material called anti-matter, then a part could be started with an extrude into nothing, but would remove material from whatever it was added to. At least that's my concept. Then I could start a part with the hole the part needs.

                                                     

                                                     

                                                    You are getting to the core of the decision process.

                                                     

                                                    Do I add holes, then associate items with the hole. Or is there a way to have holes associated with the item.

                                                     

                                                    Open up the attached weldnuts. I added a sketch circle to them in case there was away to use that to create the holes for the weldnut. Then configurations of that part would allow that to change on the fly.

                                                     

                                                    To keep thing KISS, designing with holes and adding parts to the holes is the way to go. Then using favorites in the hole wizard, and adding custom fasteners to the toolbox (I hope I can) would be the fastest method of designing welded threads to sheet metal.

                                                     

                                                    I do the same stuff all the time, over and over again.

                                                      • Re: Hole decimal size
                                                        Matt Peneguy

                                                        If I remember correctly, you would put your weld nut into an assembly with a "dummy" part.  Mate it to the dummy part and create an extruded hole into the dummy part.  Then when you create the Smart Component, you choose the extruded hole as one of the features that gets packed into the Smart Component.  Once you add the Smart Component you get access to the options for the hole as shown in the video I posted.

                                                        You'd do good to find a tutorial on Smart Components.  Creating them isn't completely straight forward.  When I played with them I used Matt Lombard's example in one of his SW Bible books.  It's been a while though.

                                                        Edit to Add:  I found this video that looks like it packs a few cut features with it as a Smart Component.  I haven't watched it all, but I think he's doing something similar to what you need: SOLIDWORKS Smart Component - YouTube

                                                        Second Edit: Ignore the above video...WATCH THIS ONE: Introduction To Cabinetry Within SolidWorks Part 3: Smart Parts - YouTube. It is 15 minutes long, I'm 9 minutes into it and it is pretty darn good so far.