29 Replies Latest reply on Jan 31, 2018 7:12 AM by Dennis Dohogne

    2018 TOP TEN LIST.Wrong voting system!!!

    Igor Fomenko

      This 2018 TOP TEN LIST doesn`t contain any valuable information because it doesn`t contain rating information of each idea.

      Each idea must have rating for each voter.

      Valuable information is Rating =  Summ of idea rating of each voter.

      I`m sorry, but this top list is nothing!!!

      At present voting system I see only one possibility to correct this list: DON`T VOTE FOR NONCRITICAL IDEAS.

      But how SWX RD found out our wishes in this case.

        • Re: 2018 TOP TEN LIST.Wrong voting system!!!
          Alin Vargatu

          I agree that there should be a better explanation about how this system works. New users might believe that this is a competition, and only the top 10 ideas will be implemented. That is not the case.

           

          Users should vote on all ideas they consider beneficial. SOLIDWORKS is looking at all ideas, not only at the top 10. Historically, many lower ranked ideas have been implemented in the next 2 releases.

           

          So do not worry, Igor. Just vote on the ones you like.

           

          Also, comment. Explain why you feel strongly for or against of an idea. That is even more important than voting.

            • Re: 2018 TOP TEN LIST.Wrong voting system!!!
              Alex Lachance

              Speaking for myself, I have no idea how to browse through it quickly without reading them one by one, let alone sort the list to facilitate the prioritizing. The naming is done by an Average Joe just like me so every Average Joe has their way of wording stuff that might be different from one another. This makes the whole process extremely complicated to browse through.

               

              Right now, there is only one type of filtering we can do and that is a filter by what category the enhancement affects. That is somewhat useful but mostly useless because once again the whole thing depends solely on the Average Joe filling the thing correctly, or at all. Unless of course there is someone from SolidWorks who passes over every idea to make sure it is in the correct category  but I have my doubts as my ideas haven't been categorized yet.

               

              Am I missing something here?

                • Re: 2018 TOP TEN LIST.Wrong voting system!!!
                  John Stoltzfus

                  No your not missing something - that is why I put together the Excel Spreadsheet so we can sort and filter how we need it. 

                   

                  I said it before the entire forum search feature should be totally redone and the Top Ten list makes it a glaring issue again. 

                    • Re: 2018 TOP TEN LIST.Wrong voting system!!!
                      Alex Lachance

                      Exactly, it should be redone and you shouldn't have to be doing this spreadsheet. The fact that you have to make a spread sheet to help people vote should be enough of an alarm for SolidWorks to do something and fix it. I mean, the fact that the idea subimissioning thing is so problematic and hasn't been fixed would be enough to discourage many people from actually voting.

                       

                      I see it this way, if they're not gonna fix the voting system(and forums), why would they fix the program I know it's not the case but try explaining that to stubborn people.

                        • Re: 2018 TOP TEN LIST.Wrong voting system!!!
                          John Stoltzfus

                          Totally understand where it's coming from Alex Lachance -  The biggest issues lies in us Forum Users to Frame the question correctly, instead of

                           

                          Can you help me with my sketch layout....

                           

                          (it could read)

                           

                          Sketch, Layout, Assistance Needed

                           

                          and that will always be that way, unless SW decides to help us and do a force categorization, where they set something up like the SIC Codes, where there would be a popup dialog box that would make you select...  "Sketch" "Layout" "Assistance Required"  etc.  They could make that change.

                            • Re: 2018 TOP TEN LIST.Wrong voting system!!!
                              Alex Lachance

                              That's fine and all for them and I understand the purpose of this. I'm saying it should be revamped, not removed entirely.

                               

                              They could even forget about the revamping and just hire someone to do the categorizing on their side(approval or correcting of categories). To me, there's nothing smart about having a list of categories that you use without having someone moderating the ideas to make sure the categories are correct. I'm guessing there are more stuff that are incorrectly categorized then there are stuff that are correctly categorized. Someone could select every existing category just for the heck of it right now and it would remain that way as far as I'm aware.

                               

                              Have you ever used any other forums? When I was a teen, I was an avid StarCraft gamer and I was also a forum administrator for a community of 12 000 members which would generate over 1.5k posts per day. The software used for our forums was vBulletin and it was very customizable.

                               

                              We had 3 programmers and about 10 Admins/moderators for the forums. Just like here, the programmers couldn't be spending most of their time reading the forums and moderating them, so we designated general community members to start helping with certain tasks such as moderating specific forums.

                                • Re: 2018 TOP TEN LIST.Wrong voting system!!!
                                  John Stoltzfus

                                  Alex Lachance  wrote:

                                   

                                  That's fine and all for them and I understand the purpose of this. I'm saying it should be revamped, not removed entirely.

                                   

                                  They could even forget about the revamping and just hire someone to do the categorizing on their side(approval or correcting of categories). To me, there's nothing smart about having a list of categories that you use without having someone moderating the ideas to make sure the categories are correct. I'm guessing there are more stuff that are incorrectly categorized then there are stuff that are correctly categorized. Someone could select every existing category just for the heck of it right now and it would remain that way as far as I'm aware.

                                   

                                  Have you ever used any other forums? When I was a teen, I was an avid StarCraft gamer and I was also a forum administrator for a community of 12 000 members which would generate over 1.5k posts per day. The software used for our forums was vBulletin and it was very customizable.

                                   

                                  We had 3 programmers and about 10 Admins/moderators for the forums. Just like here, the programmers couldn't be spending most of their time reading the forums and moderating them, so we designated general community members to start helping with certain tasks such as moderating specific forums.

                                   

                                  It is also bigger than what we're talking about here,  the other hindrance is the international reach and the language barriers we need to deal with, especially since the English language is one of the hardest to understand, because you can go fast as in racing, get tied to a tree and remain fast if you don't break the rope, or not eat because of religious purposes is to fast..... there are words that are a lot worse or worser or worsestedted.....

                          • Re: 2018 TOP TEN LIST.Wrong voting system!!!
                            Rick McDonald

                            Alex Lachance wrote:

                             

                            .... The naming is done by an Average Joe just like me so every Average Joe has their way of wording stuff that might be different from one another. This makes the whole process extremely complicated to browse through.

                             

                            ... Unless of course there is someone from SolidWorks who passes over every idea to make sure it is in the correct category but I have my doubts as my ideas haven't been categorized yet.

                             

                            Am I missing something here?

                            Alex,

                            True that the Average Joe's wording and Categorizing is not always correct or the best, but I have noticed that on several of the Top Ten titles or ideas that they are being looked at by SolidWorks people (I don't know if All are or how extensively).

                            I have seen Shaodun Lin's and Matthew Lorono's come up several times for suggested title or content changes to make it more clear as to what the subject or ideas are or to identify ones that are very similar to others or ones that have been implemented already.

                            That's helping at least.

                             

                            I have also downloaded John Stoltzfus' Excel file and have added an extra column to show me quickly what is of interest to me (simply by putting a colored background in the cell) and then when I have voted I will just mark that off.

                            I can make a first pass of most desirable to me and when those are voted on I can go through again and consider others when I have the time.

                            It is a Whole lot easier then going through each category and trying to remember what I have voted on already or reading ones that I can clearly see I don't care about by the title and don't have to re-view them.

                             

                            I do agree that we should have at lease something like "Important, would be nice or doesn't apply to me"

                            For instance, we don't use SWX PDM so that is not important to ME but to someone that uses PDM it might be top of the list, so best would be to have some categories and only vote (up or down) if they apply to your company and then have a top xx number for each category.

                          • Re: 2018 TOP TEN LIST.Wrong voting system!!!
                            Dennis Dohogne

                            Alin Vargatu wrote:

                             

                            I agree that there should be a better explanation about how this system works. New users might believe that this is a competition, and only the top 10 ideas will be implemented. That is not the case.

                             

                            Users should vote on all ideas they consider beneficial. SOLIDWORKS is looking at all ideas, not only at the top 10. Historically, many lower ranked ideas have been implemented in the next 2 releases.

                             

                            So do not worry, Igor. Just vote on the ones you like.

                             

                            Also, comment. Explain why you feel strongly for or against of an idea. That is even more important than voting.

                            Alin is correct in these comments and they really need to be accentuated so more people actually add their comments.  These comments help SWX to better understand what we really want and even yield some insight into how to achieve them.

                          • Re: 2018 TOP TEN LIST.Wrong voting system!!!
                            John Stoltzfus

                            Igor Fomenko  wrote:

                             

                            This 2018 TOP TEN LIST doesn`t contain any valuable information because it doesn`t contain rating information of each idea.

                            Each idea must have rating for each voter.

                            Valuable information is Rating = Summ of idea rating of each voter.

                            I`m sorry, but this top list is nothing!!!

                            At present voting system I see only one possibility to correct this list: DON`T VOTE FOR NONCRITICAL IDEAS.

                            But how SWX RD found out our wishes in this case.

                            Not clear on your message - how would you expect we get to the "Idea Rating Of Each User"

                             

                            Just vote for the ones you're interested in and that's it, no more etc..  If we all do that then the list will come together pretty nicely.

                              • Re: 2018 TOP TEN LIST.Wrong voting system!!!
                                Igor Fomenko

                                Moderator didn`t give me ability to place link to good whishlist web site.

                                So I try to explain as I can.

                                For example, I like a lot of ideas but some of them are very critical for me. Hence I have to rank each idea as you rank

                                "How should we allocate our 2018 R&D resources?" for example but more simple from 1 to 5 or to 10. So you give rank to each idea you like.

                                As a result SWX have to summ all ranks for each idea to understand who win. Without ranking it`s impossible to understand what idea is most critical. I hope you understand me.

                              • Re: 2018 TOP TEN LIST.Wrong voting system!!!
                                Alin Vargatu

                                One thing that would be very handy would be to allow each user to sort the idea based on a simple criterion:

                                 

                                "Did I vote on it, or not?"

                                 

                                So allow me to show only the ones I have not voted on yet.

                                 

                                Even better, give us to sorting criteria: voted and read.

                                  • Re: 2018 TOP TEN LIST.Wrong voting system!!!
                                    Richard Gergely

                                    Alin I have voted on a couple ideas and a few things come to mind as  result.

                                     

                                    There doesn't seem that many votes - on analytical level surely we need like thousands of votes to get any real data.

                                     

                                    Secondly people who only use the forum are voting. This makes the voting relevant to the kind of person who comes on the forum which quite likely would not fully reflect the user base.

                                     

                                    What's your thoughts?

                                      • Re: 2018 TOP TEN LIST.Wrong voting system!!!
                                        Alex Lachance

                                        You are right.


                                        Has anyone received any info-letter from their VAR regarding the 2018 TOP 10? I haven't gotten one to tell me that the idea submitting was open nor one to tell me that the voting had began. There is no way for me to know about this unless I browse these forums regularly, which I do thankfully.

                                        • Re: 2018 TOP TEN LIST.Wrong voting system!!!
                                          Alin Vargatu

                                          Richard Gergely wrote:

                                           

                                          Alin I have voted on a couple ideas and a few things come to mind as result.

                                           

                                          There doesn't seem that many votes - on analytical level surely we need like thousands of votes to get any real data.

                                           

                                          Secondly people who only use the forum are voting. This makes the voting relevant to the kind of person who comes on the forum which quite likely would not fully reflect the user base.

                                           

                                          What's your thoughts?

                                          All these are valid concerns. We need to do more to spread the news, and explain the benefits of being engaged in the SOLIDWORKS Community.

                                           

                                          How many managers know that proposing and voting on these ideas is the simplest and surest way to influence the development of SOLIDWORKS?

                                           

                                          That is why I started this thread (Time to Vote on the Future of SOLIDWORKS!), to have a simple link that I can send to my customers, explaining the benefits of voting and offering a short list of ideas that are relevant to them.

                                            • Re: 2018 TOP TEN LIST.Wrong voting system!!!
                                              Richard Gergely

                                              Alin you are one of only a few VAR's who are active on the forum, which is a shame.

                                               

                                              A starting point for the resellers/VAR's would be to at least do a news letter on their websites that the 10 ten list is available to vote on. As Alex has pointed out the optimum would be a email/letter to their user base.

                                               

                                              I dare say in the UK if you asked a VAR most would say I have heard of the 'top ten' but not much beyond that.

                                        • Re: 2018 TOP TEN LIST.Wrong voting system!!!
                                          Adrian Velazquez

                                          Agree completely an already had suggested something a few years ago, in IMHO:

                                           

                                          1. I shouldn't have to vote for my own ideas
                                          2. A user would have a max of 20 ideas to vote up
                                          3. A user would have 5 ideas to vote down
                                          4. The Top 10 list as should be broken down into two or more list
                                            1. One list for Core SolidWorks
                                            2. Another list for Other Products (PDM, Composer, MBD, Visualize, PCB..etc)
                                            3. This would help those of us that OWN AND PAY SUBSCRIPTION to get some R&D development for those products

                                           

                                          A system like this would help Prioritize resources and cut the gimmicky improvements.

                                          • Re: 2018 TOP TEN LIST.Wrong voting system!!!
                                            Shaodun Lin

                                            Hi Igor:

                                             

                                            Personally, I like your idea very much: Please add BOM filter  I think it deserves to be in the top ten list.

                                            I had voted.

                                             

                                            If you could add more details/graphic to your idea, for example:

                                            1. The current situation
                                            2. The future state
                                            3. You proposed solution
                                            4. The business impact,
                                            5. How is other competitor's solution

                                             

                                            I think there will be more people understand your idea and give you an upvote.

                                             

                                            This is my example from SWW2017 top ten:

                                            1.jpg

                                            2.jpg

                                            • Re: 2018 TOP TEN LIST.Wrong voting system!!!
                                              Igor Fomenko

                                              Example of simplest rank system

                                              Simplest rank system.GIF

                                              With these top ideas you have to go to Los Angeles.

                                              • Re: 2018 TOP TEN LIST.Wrong voting system!!!
                                                Dennis Dohogne

                                                Igor,

                                                You are not alone:

                                                Top Ten Idea Submission and What the Voting Means

                                                Will the Top Ten List be handled differently this year?

                                                Small Suggestions for making Top Ten Voting Easier

                                                These posts evoked some healthy discussion and good ideas.  The good news is that the folks at SWX are listening and want to make some changes along these lines.  The bad news is that it is painfully slow to implement any of these changes.  I won't hold my breath, but perhaps Bruce Holway can chime in here.

                                                • Re: 2018 TOP TEN LIST.Wrong voting system!!!
                                                  Michel Ketterle

                                                  In My Opinion the Presentation of the Ideas is also not god to promote Good Ideas. There are many ways to only show the most voted Ideas. And also there are possibilities to get more attention if you send your Idea at the correct time of the day so your Idea is listet under the last edited ons. Both are not good to guarantee a good voting.

                                                  Please remove the list of votes per idea and also please remove the possibility to list ideas by last edit/change.